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Footage 35mm / 4k - Others

wichaeljackson

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all fans always argue about michael jackson tours and music videos that could be restored in 4k because they were recorded with a 35mm camera, but what about other events? motown 25, superbowl 1993 and other such events with mj participation, is there any information about the recording source? whether such records could be converted to 4k? or is there no evidence?
 

Earth Michael

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Hasta donde yo sé, Motown 25 se grabó en cinta magnética y la SuperBowl, siendo emitido en directo, seguramente su respaldo también fuera cinta magnética (tipo Betamax, que tiene más calidad que un VHS pero que no llega ni a la suela de los talones al 35mm).

De hecho, en 2014 (época en la que el BluRay ya estaba totalmente afianzado a nivel comercial), solo publicaron el Motown 25 en DVD, por lo que se entiende que es la máxima calidad que pudieron extraer.
 

jahirloco

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Hasta donde yo sé, Motown 25 se grabó en cinta magnética y la SuperBowl, siendo emitido en directo, seguramente su respaldo también fuera cinta magnética (tipo Betamax, que tiene más calidad que un VHS pero que no llega ni a la suela de los talones al 35mm).

De hecho, en 2014 (época en la que el BluRay ya estaba totalmente afianzado a nivel comercial), solo publicaron el Motown 25 en DVD, por lo que se entiende que es la máxima calidad que pudieron extraer.
Aunque existe el Blu Ray SD, orientado a explotar al máximo la calidad del audio, y realmente no me fio del DVD por la compresión siempre es bueno renderizar a un bit rate mayor mejor para no tener perdida de calidad en la compresión de los formatos, el canal de la NFL tiene un video con fragmentos del superbowl 93, No se porque no hacen una Playlist con los super bowl del pasado remasterizados, deberían hacerlo, y con respecto a otros eventos pues los fans claman al estate porque es el que mayor posibilidad tiene que haga este tipo de proyectos y con lo de la situación de la imagen pública no creo que otras organizaciones quieran tener algo que ver con MJ por lo menos por más tiempo.
 

therealCTE

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All Michaels tours weren’t shot on 35mm.
history they were using a lot higher quality cameras (not using film though) but I’m pretty sure it was only really bad tour that had whole concerts shot on 35mm and that was only like 3-4 or so.
dangerous tours higher quality footage like Munich’s promo (still unleaked but we have photos) and bow Tokyo still aren’t on film so I assume they wouldn’t be proper film quality level, and also, like Munich, they’re just promos for that quality to my knowledge. So only a song or two or like Munich, snippets of a few songs
 

jahirloco

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All Michaels tours weren’t shot on 35mm.
history they were using a lot higher quality cameras (not using film though) but I’m pretty sure it was only really bad tour that had whole concerts shot on 35mm and that was only like 3-4 or so.
dangerous tours higher quality footage like Munich’s promo (still unleaked but we have photos) and bow Tokyo still aren’t on film so I assume they wouldn’t be proper film quality level, and also, like Munich, they’re just promos for that quality to my knowledge. So only a song or two or like Munich, snippets of a few songs
Se cual hablas de Tokyo, pero a cual hablas de Munich podrías pasar videos o fotos de lo que hablas por favor?
 

jahirloco

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Yeah, that was my whole point. When I say film I mean 35mm
Entiendo, Pero no sólo promos sino que todos los conciertos están a esa calidad o deberían si exiten los beta masters originales, tristemente hemos obtenido copias VHS de 3 y 4 generación.
 

therealCTE

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Entiendo, Pero no sólo promos sino que todos los conciertos están a esa calidad o deberían si exiten los beta masters originales, tristemente hemos obtenido copias VHS de 3 y 4 generación.
Incorrect.
to my knowledge, all Michaels concerts were put onto normal vhs’s.
Bremen’s first generation. These concerts were only basically recorded for Michael to rewatch, take notes and improve things for the next show.

Full Concerts that were filmed in higher quality were planned ahead of time and for that specific show.
It’s literally a waste of money, time and everything else just for Michael to look at and give notes to himself and everyone
 

jahirloco

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Incorrect.
to my knowledge, all Michaels concerts were put onto normal vhs’s.
Bremen’s first generation. These concerts were only basically recorded for Michael to rewatch, take notes and improve things for the next show.

Full Concerts that were filmed in higher quality were planned ahead of time and for that specific show.
It’s literally a waste of money, time and everything else just for Michael to look at and give notes to himself and everyone
Si exiten mejores copias del bad tour En beta máster por que Al dangerous tour usarían un formato de menor calidad? Waste of money? El dinero y con todo lo que estaban generando lo tenían.
 

therealCTE

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B
Si exiten mejores copias del bad tour En beta máster por que Al dangerous tour usarían un formato de menor calidad? Waste of money? El dinero y con todo lo que estaban generando lo tenían.
ad tour appeared to be done completely differently. They had multiple shows recorded in 35mm.
we know two Wembley shows were completely colour graded.
I’d take that as there was gonna be a planned release that was cancelled and likely going to be a mix of shows.
As for dangerous tour all we know of in these good quality are promo tapes. I’d say the best quality they were recording whole concerts was what we see in Bucharest.
history tour was shot on a new format too. I’d imagine dangerous was the same.
Also, as for dangerous tours good quality for shows recorded and stored, they may very well be lost if they were given back to Michael cause he was notorious for losing everything.

bottom line is tho, not all concerts were filmed and stored in that high quality
 

CristobalH96

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All Michaels tours weren’t shot on 35mm.
history they were using a lot higher quality cameras (not using film though) but I’m pretty sure it was only really bad tour that had whole concerts shot on 35mm and that was only like 3-4 or so.
dangerous tours higher quality footage like Munich’s promo (still unleaked but we have photos) and bow Tokyo still aren’t on film so I assume they wouldn’t be proper film quality level, and also, like Munich, they’re just promos for that quality to my knowledge. So only a song or two or like Munich, snippets of a few songs
some dangerous tour shows was filmed in 16 or 35 mm, im pretty sure about 16mm due the size of the camera, like bangkok 93 and madrid 92
 

jahirloco

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ad tour appeared to be done completely differently. They had multiple shows recorded in 35mm.
we know two Wembley shows were completely colour graded.
I’d take that as there was gonna be a planned release that was cancelled and likely going to be a mix of shows.
As for dangerous tour all we know of in these good quality are promo tapes. I’d say the best quality they were recording whole concerts was what we see in Bucharest.
history tour was shot on a new format too. I’d imagine dangerous was the same.
Also, as for dangerous tours good quality for shows recorded and stored, they may very well be lost if they were given back to Michael cause he was notorious for losing everything.

bottom line is tho, not all concerts were filmed and stored in that high quality
Fácilmente Le podían hacer copias VHS a MJ como Efectivamente pasó con wembley 88 donde La única copia que se encontró fue una VHS personal de MJ del 16 de julio, Así que si creo que Hay buena calidad de Imagen en todos los conciertos del dangerous tour y lo que dije fue que lamentablemente solo han salido a la luz copias De VHS de segunda y tercera generación creo recordar que así fue que se filtro argentina que MJ regalo el VHS a un piloto o alguien que tenía que ver con su parada del tour en Argentina, corriganme si me equivoco.
 

jahirloco

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Fácilmente Le podían hacer copias VHS a MJ como Efectivamente pasó con wembley 88 donde La única copia que se encontró fue una VHS personal de MJ del 16 de julio, Así que si creo que Hay buena calidad de Imagen en todos los conciertos del dangerous tour y lo que dije fue que lamentablemente solo han salido a la luz copias De VHS de segunda y tercera generación creo recordar que así fue que se filtro argentina que MJ regalo el VHS a un piloto o alguien que tenía que ver con su parada del tour en Argentina, corriganme si me equivoco.
De hecho en Dangerous short films en la última parte se ven varias tomas de varios conciertos en una calidad decente,
 

therealCTE

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some dangerous tour shows was filmed in 16 or 35 mm, im pretty sure about 16mm due the size of the camera, like bangkok 93 and madrid 92
I made a post and put on screencaptures of 35mm and 16mm in some concerts of dangerous tour like Argentina and Mexico.
I’ll actually take that. 93 was the only one I don’t have much info on. Didn’t actually think there was any info.
just the Argentina concert which idk if we know what it was filmed with cause that was done through a 3rd party.
what Michael gave to his driver (what we have) to my recollection was just a rough cut, final rough cut for approval or whatever which would make sense to be on vhs.
Mexico, I knew it was intended for release, later scrapped as well and we got those 4 songs from it in the broadcast.

as I said, I don’t know much to do with 93 but Argentina was definitely shot through a third party and correct me if I’m wrong but wasn’t Mexico as well?
If that is the case then we can’t really use at least those 93 shows as an example cause with putting two and two together with Michaels mental state and drug issue and the fact that the Argentina show was basically completely the 3rd party’s control cause it sounded as if Michael just wanted to check the final product which was COMPLETELY wrong in every aspect...
I couldn’t think Michael would have had much to do with it because solely how different the shooting and audio stuff is. In other words seemed like they weren’t given guidance of what to do.
I’d also assume with that that the cameras and basically everything shooting the show and audio was their ideas and decisions.

Just some food for thought.
Not discounting or discrediting 93 though.

for 92 in Madrid, can you show me stuff which shows it is shot in 16mm?
Genuinely would love to see and am intrigued
 

therealCTE

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Fácilmente Le podían hacer copias VHS a MJ como Efectivamente pasó con wembley 88 donde La única copia que se encontró fue una VHS personal de MJ del 16 de julio, Así que si creo que Hay buena calidad de Imagen en todos los conciertos del dangerous tour y lo que dije fue que lamentablemente solo han salido a la luz copias De VHS de segunda y tercera generación creo recordar que así fue que se filtro argentina que MJ regalo el VHS a un piloto o alguien que tenía que ver con su parada del tour en Argentina, corriganme si me equivoco.
For your correction.
you’re basically right. As stated above, story of Argentina is in short, got it shot, got it mixed and edited, they sent Michael a vhs of the show and Michael apparently hated the way it was shot and mixed he just canceled the whole thing then at the end of his drivers job he gave him that vhs as a thank you.

Something like that
 

therealCTE

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De hecho en Dangerous short films en la última parte se ven varias tomas de varios conciertos en una calidad decente,
Yeahhhhhhhhh, around the same as Bucharest.
that’s the quality some would be shot on.
nothing really special tbh.

on that note, someone correct me if I’m wrong and put your beliefs aside when answering it,
We do only know 100% for a fact that the vhs’s for Michael were the ones that were kept of every concert right? Or did I miss something and am looking dumb in that though
 

CristobalH96

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I’ll actually take that. 93 was the only one I don’t have much info on. Didn’t actually think there was any info.
just the Argentina concert which idk if we know what it was filmed with cause that was done through a 3rd party.
what Michael gave to his driver (what we have) to my recollection was just a rough cut, final rough cut for approval or whatever which would make sense to be on vhs.
Mexico, I knew it was intended for release, later scrapped as well and we got those 4 songs from it in the broadcast.

as I said, I don’t know much to do with 93 but Argentina was definitely shot through a third party and correct me if I’m wrong but wasn’t Mexico as well?
If that is the case then we can’t really use at least those 93 shows as an example cause with putting two and two together with Michaels mental state and drug issue and the fact that the Argentina show was basically completely the 3rd party’s control cause it sounded as if Michael just wanted to check the final product which was COMPLETELY wrong in every aspect...
I couldn’t think Michael would have had much to do with it because solely how different the shooting and audio stuff is. In other words seemed like they weren’t given guidance of what to do.
I’d also assume with that that the cameras and basically everything shooting the show and audio was their ideas and decisions.

Just some food for thought.
Not discounting or discrediting 93 though.

for 92 in Madrid, can you show me stuff which shows it is shot in 16mm?
Genuinely would love to see and am intrigued
You can see a film camera in working day and night, at the Big solo of Jennifer batten.

What You mean a 3rd party? All shows from Bad to history was recorded by nocturne pictures (actually doesnt exists) nocturne controls the jumbotron feeds and recorded On professional tapes, then was copied to vhs to Michael for check himself
 
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